New Schooner Owners

My wife, Pamela Caudill, and I are now schooner owners!

We purchased a Lazyjack 32, "Mary 'Lis," built by the Ted Hermann Boat Shop (now closed) in upstate New York in 1978.

About 32 of the Lazyjacks were built in the late 70s/early 80s. They are fiberglass centerboard schooners, 32' LOD, 39' LOA, 10'9" beam, draft 2'10" with board up, 6'6" down. Rig is Bermdua main and gaff foresail on aluminum spars. The original sailplan called for a working jib on a boom; our boat is fitted with a 130% genoa on a roller furler. Auxiliary power is a 45hp Perkins 4.108 diesel.

Below, the layout is v-berth forward; to port, hanging locker, dinette and quarterberth; to starboard, head compartment, galley and quarterberth.

The boat is laying on Florida's gulf coast. We plan a week of shakedown sailing there in January, and will sail the boat to her new home on Mobile Bay in late February. We plan for sailing in our home waters (Mobile Bay, Mississippi Sound, Pensacola) for a year or so, then longer cruises in the Gulf, Keys, Bahamas and the East Coast ICW.

So far as we know we'll be one of only two schooners on Mobile Bay, the other being the "Joshua," a 50-something foot wooden schooner that's the official tall ship of Mobile, AL.

We unfortunately can't make this year's annual meeting as the dates overlap with our window for moving the boat home. We hope to make future events and meet up with some of you there.

Our current boat, a Rob Roy 23 yawl, "Fiddlestix," is still up for sale (see the "Classifieds" board).

Mike Turner
Rob Roy 23 yawl "Fiddlestix"
Lazyjack 32 schooner "Mary 'Lis"
Mobile Bay, Alabama

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Congratulations Mike! Welcome to the fleet. Have fun! Look forward to meeting up with you somewhere along the way.
Paul Gray

Another New Schooner in the Fleet!

Well, shipmates, after years of searching, dead ends, rotten transoms and a scam artist from Lunenburg who demolished my lovely 1929 fishermen's schooner while i was just getting started refurbishing and rebuilding her, we have finnally found our schooner! Her name is Lady Galadriel, she is a Cheoy Lee Clipper 36, one of only three or four built (and i have not been able to find any of the others-help?). Fiberglass hull and wooden uppers. We took her over from a great captain, Paul Sims in San Diego, and have brought her back to the east coast where she was born and bred. Bringing her up to speed in Dutch Wharf Boatyard in CT, where the crew knows and appreciates schooners.

By the way, Annie doesn't know about this yet, it will be the biggest birthday/anniversary surprise ever, when she appears on the hook in Jamestown this summer to her immense delight! Yeha, i know, all guys say that when they want to buy a boat and not tell their wives, but this one is the real thing!!

dean and annie cycon


Congratulations on the new boat. With respect to Dutch Wharf, you may be interested to see comments under Schooner Splendid on the schooner page. Although Dutch Wharf may say they know and appreciate schooners, the last schooner they had in for restoration was a beautiful and very complete Alden 309 which they utterly ruined through an astonishing level of incompetence on a fairly extensive restoration effort. If Dutch Wharf is doing a serious dollar value of work on your boat you may wish to consider hiring a qualified marine surveyor to oversee their work. They didn't stand behind the work they did on Splendid after their work product failed a marine survey. Just a heads up to a fellow member. Good luck on the suprise.


Hello Mike and Pamela

Paul and I also sail a Lazy Jack 32. We are on the Chesapeake Bay.

As a fellow Mobile Bay native I am excited to hear this wonderful news. Congratulations. My dream is to some day be sailing along with you in the Mobile Bay/Northern Gulf coast area. I love the thought of a January shakedown cruise. My first sail adventure was on New Years Eve 1999 in the Mobile Bay. Love that weather!

Joshua is a beauty with an interesting story. We need to talk the Captain in to a visit to Mystic.

There is also a very nice group of Schooners in Biloxi at the Maritime and Seafood Industry Museum. They are also members of ASA.

Help! schooner maintenance costs?

Hi everyone,

I need your advice!

I'm putting together a proposal for a summer 'classroom on the sea' in the pacific northwest on a 80-100 ft loa wooden schooner. I'm trying to get a sense of low and especially the high end yearly maintenance costs, contingency requirements and such. This is apart from cost of a full time captain and assuming he or she would be able to do all or nearly all of the basic maintenance. I'm thinking running rigging and sail replacement cycles, hull, materials, masts and such. And this is assuming a boat in very good condition and not requiring a serious refit.

Thanks for any suggestions!


Kallista (Whitby 42, currently in Trinidad)

Yearly maintenance costs

We were advised by a very wise wood boat surveyor the following:

Your costs will be a multiplier of the boat's value. Usually, you can take a number about 1/2 way between what the boat would sell for for and what it would cost to rebuild the boat. Your hull insurance will usually reflect both these numbers and a good surveyor should be able to help you with this info too. In today's depressed boat market, the number might be a little higher than halfway, but we can use that as an illustration. When we considered what size and which boat we would commit to, we looked at this formula and made sure that we'd be able to cover the costs year in and year out for the foreseeable future.

For your desired schooner, lets say you buy your fully functional huge schooner (that would be the 80 to 100 ft range) in good enough shape to pass USCG inspection with flying colors for...oh...a truly very, very reasonable $200K. A bargain. And lets say that your replacement value of your very fine vessel is say $2.5M. Yes, this can be true--the two numbers can be far, far apart because rebuilding/replacing and maintaining your boat will cost far, far more than buying it. And $2.5M is probably a bit low--depending on the age and make of schooner that you're dealing with. Sometimes you can buy a schooner for 10K with a replacement value of $500K--as mentioned, these numbers can be far, far apart. When you're maintaining remember it's more like "replacing." So, take your numbers add them together and divide by two. You get $1.350M, right. Ok, now my knowledgeable wood boat surveyor states that you should be spending ON AVERAGE (which means if if you don't spend it all in a given year you'd better be saving it for the future so when a big, expensive year comes along you'll have the money) between 2% and 5% of that half-way number you just came up with. If you're lucky it's trends towards the 2% of course, if you bought a pig-in-a-poke, you'll be looking at the 5% number or more. OK, 2% of $1.350M is $27,000 per year and 5% of it is $67,500 per year. Each and every year you'd better have that budget or your fine schooner will be going down, down, downhill in repair until it looks like a bunch of hooligans owned it and the USCG inspection that you have to have to charter your fine boat and do you school thing...well...your schooner won't pass.

Certainly if your crew-- which you're paying out of operating funds-- is doing some routine work throughout the year, that would fall into this 2% to 5% funds. When you haul out a boat of that size, though, you're talking some big dollars. You might wish to call boatyards in the area you plan to maintain the boat in and get their haulout rates, yard rates and so forth for such a large vessel.

Those numbers are really "ball park." If you aren't the captain who is looking for a way to cover the costs of his boat, but rather you'd like to "manage" your school and let others do the sailing, you might just consider getting bids from one of the several large schooners which run as training vessels in the PNW or who are willing to relocate a California boat up there for a season. You would likely be able to contract with them for your classroom for a summer and see how it works out for your group/organization in terms of costs--BEFORE you actually commit to owning such a big schooner. If you're the captain and you're looking for a business to cover your lifestyle--then by all means, go for it. Do you already have quite a bit of experience on tall ships and suitable sailing license? If so, you likely have contacts in the tall ship world who can answer this question quite readily. Else, I'll hope that some other AMS members with big-boat maintenance experience come through and respond with additional information.

"One can remain alive long past the usual date of disintegration if one is unafraid of change, insatiable in intellectual curiosity, interested in big things, and happy in small ways." Edith Wharton